A bean bag, beanie and a laptop don't make you creative: Sir John Hegarty

What is creativity? Has the definition of creativity changed in the digital age? Do technological innovations help build brands? What is the importance of storytelling? Watch and read BBH’s co-founder, Sir John Hegarty, in conversation with Pavni Mittal, as he decodes creativity and its role in marketing communications today at_Storyboard_’s coverage of the 61stInternational Festival of Creativity. Storyboard: Sir John, when did you first attend the Cannes Lions, and how many has it been since then? STORY CONTINUES BELOW THIS AD Sir John: Sadly, I am getting to the point where there is more and more behind me. When I first came in, in 1989, I was on the only jury that existed back then - Film. The Cannes Lions was a different sort of festival with a focus on film - television and commercials in cinema in those days. Storyboard: That was the glamorous media at that time… Sir John: Yes, that was the media as we know it now. They extended it to Print and Posters in the early 90s, and since then, the festival has grown and grown. To be honest, the festival isn’t really for advertising agencies, but was more about the production companies. As our industry became more global gradually, Cannes was the natural benefiter of that movement with more people pouring into the festival. Storyboard: The three big changes that you see here? Sir John: I would go with the massive globalization, the advancement of technology and the growth in categories that you have at Cannes now. It is enormous! After conversations with various people from the industry, I would even say it has gotten too big. I would even go as far as saying that it is losing its focus on creativity and brand building, which is ultimately what we are here to do. I think that focus should concern people who run Cannes, if it doesn’t concern them already. STORY CONTINUES BELOW THIS AD Storyboard: So where do you think the focus has shifted to exactly? Sir John: Well, I would say it has gone to things which are innovative, and I do like that. However, it may not necessarily be the right creative execution or the right thing for a brand to do. Maybe a brand should do just a brilliant poster, commercial or a print ad. Those things seem to be subdued or pushed down in relation to innovation. As great as that is, is it really brand building? Storyboard: One of the biggest themes this year is ’the return of creativity’, but in context of the digital age. Are you seeing this as one of the big themes as well? STORY CONTINUES BELOW THIS AD Sir John: No, I am not personally seeing that. If you went to South by Southwest last year, you will see that the big theme there was all about storytelling. There have been a number of talks here about storytelling. I believe that’s the thing we have to get back to; it is fundamental to building brands. There is a huge danger of focusing on technology rather than focusing on ideas. Techonology is just a means to deliver the idea, but we seem to be wound up in all that it can do. That’s all great, but what I really want to see are ideas. Ideas are what transform people to feel or think. STORY CONTINUES BELOW THIS AD Storyboard: Is that what inspired you to write your book ‘Hegarty On Creativity’? A large chunk of it is focused on creative deficit… Sir John: People talk about creativity in the UK and in India in all its facets. We see business leaders vehemently going ‘we need more creativity’ or ’the future is creative’. I was reading things about creativity by people who had never had an idea or executed one. I got tired of listening to people who obviously don’t know anything about having an idea. I thought I should write a book not about advertising, but about creativity. The examples in the book come from everywhere - music, fashion, architecture or what have you. STORY CONTINUES BELOW THIS AD I didn’t put it in the book, although I should have - sitting on a bean bag, wearing a beanie with a laptop, does not make you creative. We need to establish that first. Storyboard: In your opinion, what should creativity mean in this digital age, of which the definition has obviously evolved? Sir John: I don’t think so at all. It may seem so because we think the world has changed since digital has come along. No, it hasn’t! It has made things wonderful in lots of ways; it is wonderful how I can Google stuff and talk to people, but it hasn’t changed the essential nature of creativity except for allowing us to do many more things. We have looked at technology to help us be more creative, right since the beginning of time. People often ask, “What is creativity?” and it is often said that music is the greatest of all art forms. I say it is the second greatest of all art forms, because life is the greatest of all art forms. Therefore, we are all creative because expressing yourself in some shape or form is a creative act. Storyboard: You said something very interesting - people often forget that technology is the handmaiden of creativity. Could you amplify that? Sir John: I have talked a little bit about storytelling, which is so fundamental to our existence. It is how we convey information, communicate, create myths and how we bring people together. What we essentially want is to find different ways of communicating those stories. The invention of the movie camera was a wonderful way of helping us tell a story through film. Its creators never made the films themselves. It was the creative people who came along and said, ‘Wow! You could tell a story like this too." We are in a place where there are a lot of technologists coming up with brilliant ideas, but what we need now is creative people going “What we could do with that is this…” Storyboard: Have you seen a successful example where technology has been the handmaiden of creativity at Cannes? Sir John: Everything we do has technology behind it, so it is everywhere. I can’t think of anything in particular I may have seen at Cannes, though. I like certain things and have my own prejudices about that, which is as it should be. I particularly like the idea that came from America about naming hurricanes. That was a wonderful idea. I particularly like ‘Volvo Trucks’ too - a classic, wonderful, simple piece of storytelling. Creative work always has to differentiate between creativity and innovation. In my mind, creativity is something that has a soul behind it, while innovation is making things better. I look for things that have a soul to them, a kind of truth in their foundation and create something almost out of nothing. That is what, for me, makes creativity great. Storyboard: Do you think creatives today are in awe of technology? Is it fear that is stopping them from optimizing its use? Sir John: Yes. I think there is the whole thing of ‘I don’t understand it’. I say don’t worry about it! There are lots of people who don’t understand it; just be aware of it and know about it. You don’t have to have a science degree to write a science fiction novel; it’s the imagination that is more important. Be inquisitive, be curious. As I said in my book, it is important to constantly ask the question ‘why’. A creative mind has got to be constantly curious. Storyboard: You said that a creative mind has to have ‘fearlessness’. But given the economy, how risk averse clients are today, do you think it is possible for creatives in agencies to be fearless considering the people they are selling their ideas to aren’t? Sir John: The reason I say a creative person has to be fearless is more for themselves. Remember I am writing this for people just in advertising; I am writing it for someone who is an architect or painting a picture or someone writing a novel. The great danger for creative people is when they have had huge success, and when they just repeat it over and over. However, they need to have the courage to stop doing that, step away from that success and do something completely different and fresh. That is very difficult; you have an idea and you try to do something different with it and suppose it doesn’t work out. The next time you have an idea and they say “You know John’s lost it with that last idea”, you got to have the courage to say ‘forget it! Here is something great!’ That is what I mean by fearlessness; it is about trying and wanting to do something constantly fresh. Especially when it comes to our industry, you have to constantly try and encourage clients to keep their ideas fresh. You can always tell when a company is in decline when process overtakes innovation. It might take five or twenty years, but the decline will happen. I try encouraging my clients; they have got to be more daring. I try not to say ‘be risky’ because I don’t think people want to be that. I talk about excitement - ‘This idea is exciting’. ‘Don’t you want an exciting idea? An exciting life? An exciting car?’ No one wants a risky car, day or meal. While selling an idea, try using words a client just might buy into. The art of salesmanship is very important. Storyboard: When you won the St. Mark award at Cannes Lions 2011, you said that the industry must master the art of generating global ideas. Do you still stand by that statement in 2014, or do you think we have achieved that? Sir John: No, we haven’t and I would like to recant on that remark to an extent. I am looking at more and more work that is not touching people, for which I partly blame the globalization of creativity. We are trying to globalise so many ideas without realizing they aren’t touching people. When you create a piece of advertising, you want it to be a part of the cultural landscape and people’s lives in some shape or form. By and large, globalization has failed to deliver that. I partly blame myself for this; I still think you can do it, but the structure of companies is too complicated to allow this to happen. There are too many stakeholders trying to influence the idea thereby killing the idea. I don’t want to say it can’t be done completely; obviously it can be, considering it has been done in other industries like music, film or art. However, they don’t have so many stakeholders making decisions, unlike our industry. Storyboard: A lot of creative hotshops look at being sold to holding companies. How do you look at that trend? Sir John: We are now owned by Publicis, but look at ourselves as a bit of a hotshop. We did that deal with Publicis because we thought that was the right way to sustain the brand after Nigel and I eventually disappear into what we will be doing ultimately. Having said that, it is disappointing to see young agencies starting out and are sold out within 3-5 years. I always say that money isn’t a philosophy, it’s a tool. I also believe that money doesn’t have a voice, but has a soul. Adoration and desire for it will actually kill your career, rather than the desire to do great work. If you do great work, the money will come, don’t worry. Storyboard: What would be your three tips to give young creative hotshops, who believe being bought out will bring them scale, recognition, awards and fame much faster? Sir John: The way you build a successful company is to fill it with very talented people first off. Next, you make sure that those talented people respect each other and don’t try doing each other’s job, and lastly, focus on the long term and not the short term. Storyboard: Collaborations have become very important considering it’s a multimedia world. But you see that agencies don’t like working with each other and sharing ideas. Do you see that trend at all? Sir John: You see that all the time. It’s the age-old problem of ‘who owns the idea’ and ‘who walks up and collects the award’. A number of people can own the award, but who has the idea? I think clients need to take responsibility here and tell one agency to come up with the idea and another to implement it. That would be a better way of working. The danger today is that everyone begins with the intention of collaborating and going ‘will this idea work across platforms?’ Then, they come up with an idea that fits across platforms, but isn’t very good in any of them. Concentrate on the idea, not the platform, because if it is a great idea, it will fit across platforms. Storyboard: Last year, you were very vocal about scam advertising being a big cause for ruining the festival. Do you see other people also sharing that concern? Sir John: Sadly, not enough people. I think some of the big holding companies turn a blind eye towards the whole scam issue. They want to win lots of awards; scam is almost an illness that has crept into our culture here. How to exorcise it is a real issue. Storyboard: Is this because it has become a measurement of creativity? Sir John: We have created this thing called ‘awards’ and it has now become a beast that has overtaken us instead of it being the representation of the great work out there. It is now a so-called measurement of how well agencies are doing. Since the desperation to win awards is much, much higher, the temptation to do things which are really not true has been exaggerated. I think the only saving grace is the Effectiveness Award, where they look back and check what work really worked in the market. You won’t find any scam ads there. All of a sudden, maybe, the savior will be effectiveness! Storyboard: How do you look at the state of Indian advertising? A lot of people in India believe that it isn’t as good as its global counterparts. Sir John: I would kind of agree with them. I obviously have very high hopes for Indian creativity; it’s a naturally creative culture. In fact, talking about India as a culture is absurd; it has massive cultures, which is great for creativity. I am always very positive about India’s future, as long as you get young companies to focus on understanding and believing in creating great work. With that, in the long term, you’ll be fine. I am not entirely satisfied with the output of UK agencies myself; it’s not just about India. I look at the work UK agencies put out today and go “It’s not as good as it used to be”.